i have a question regarding the EFI engines. what does the stage 1 upgrades on an efi engine consist of as far as parts and work and projected hp output in ya'll opinion pertaining to what i have been reading in this topic? after i hear some answers then i'll throw in a little food for thought after that. i just need to know ya'll opinions first to give an educated outlook about it.

Stage 1 will be considered to be Exhaust, heads, air cleaner, tune.
There honestly should be a .5 stage where you just do performance exhaust, air cleaner, and tune and there should be some gains there, but apparently it's not going to get you as much as I would think. Hard to believe that the Briggs is already so efficient to where a better flowing air cleaner, less restrictive exhaust, and afr tuning wouldn't significantly help. I'm thinking that since the Neptune is piggybacking off the delphi ecm, that it is still not able to truly free up the tunability. There's got to be more power being left on the table.

i totally agree with you that prices are crazy on things especially when there's something new coming out and the boat community seems to go crazy on before its even out there. i'm gonna pass on some information that i acquired while running a couple of efi's several months back for what it's worth. first off you couldn't give me one right now with all the problems i have seen myself with them. i attended a Briggs class on the efi's and didn't like at all what i heard from the technician that was teaching the class. i think briggs took the cheap route out and now they are paying for it. i know there are some out there that run good but lot's that don't.

food for thought on the performance of the efi by what i've seen myself on the dyno. this is just my opinion for what it's worth. i ran a couple of bone stock engines several months back. both were running very lean up in the rpm range. the efi has an electronic ignition system that advances just like a car system would and seems to not be too bad. just because an engine is rated at a certain amount doesn't mean it is not making more power than advertised. bone stock before i fiddled with them they were making around 39 hp at 4100-4200 rpm but running in the 14-15 afr range which is not good. i was able to work around and trick the sensors just for testing purposes and the engine got into the 12 afr range and hp jumped up to about 43@4200 with a stock muffler and 44 or so @4200 with a free flowing muffler i had laying around. this is accomplished with a small single throat throttle body of about 30 mm. the engine was a little lazy down low because of the small throttle body but was able to pull ok toward the top end once the airflow picked up.

what i'm trying to get across is when you have the right combination of parts and parameters these engines can perform much better without adding way too big carbs, cams, heads and such. not that these add ons don't work but it's way too easy to get sucked in by all these claims some people make that you need all those expensive parts just to get some extra push. definitely the efi's need to be able to have the fuel curves adjusted to run right in my opinion. hopefully the add on fuel adjuster will help with that problem. the problem i saw that jumped right out at me is that if the sensors aren't just right the thing acted all kind of stupid. i think briggs needs to rethink their approach to make the engines perform better and be reliable. an efi engine is not like a carb engine at all and it needs to be run on a dyno set up to test fuel injection to see how it is acting and what needs to be done to tune it regardless of who does it as long as they are versed in what to do. that's just my opinion for what it's worth or anyone who wants to listen.

Well for all the ppl out there with efi's like myself, at this point what can we do to maintain or increase performance safely without effecting longevity


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that's a really good question. i think if you have no way to measure the afr of the engine running i would leave everything stock just in case it is running lean. the stock muffler is quite capable of handling that engine with little to no reduction in power. just because a muffler is louder or noisier doesn't mean it's doing any good. if it feels like the motor is laying down at the top end by all means get it checked so you don't fry it. as i said there are motors out there that are serving their owners well but lot's that aren't. my partner here who sells Briggs motors has two brand new ones sitting on his floor he can't sell because they won't run from day one. just pay attention to how it acts when you're using it.

Well I'm definitely ready for some tuning options, not only for the 43 hp mentioned above but for dialing the motor in perfectly as to increase reliability


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The Neptune system isn't any more expensive than buying the same parts for a carb'ed motor. The prices for the parts are exactly the same, the only difference is the tuner, is $400, and you pay $500 for the Briggs EFI. A Carb kit is $865. That's a $35 difference.

The Tuner is a piggyback system that has been around for a long time. The same system is used on literally hundreds of thousands of motorcycles, atv's, snowmobiles, etc. I have built the maps to give you very good power, at safe AFR numbers. I have tested them from -10' to 7500' elevation.

Briggs has done a great job of correcting the issues that have come up with these engines. Mud Buddy has sold hundreds of them, and has only seen around 5% that have had any issues at all. That's pretty good considering They are using our industry as guinea pigs for this engine. As far as I know They haven't released it for use on lawnmowers yet, which dwarfs us by probably 20 times.

I get it...... We do not live in LA. I also know at one time BPS didn't have the greatest customer service, but I feel I have got that under control over the last couple years.

This system is simple, safe, and has been tested extensively.

Glade-Any videos of anyone running these packages yet?

I will say that a carb setup isn't 865, it's just 865 from yall. I don't begrudge yall making your money, as you're a business, just know that it isn't exactly an apples to apples on price, if we're being completely honest.

Do those prices take the refundable heads into consideration? In other words, by buying those packages you are getting heads, if we return our used heads, is there a refund like BPS had done previous for IM heads?

Just saying. When I had motorcycles. The PC-III-R programmer and a full exhaust system cut get you somewhere in the neighborhood of +45hp on a zx12r. The programmer was less than $300

It's simple. get a mud motor. shoot ducks in the face.

Finally a video on a BPS EFI kit from fastduck motors, looks great with the hammer prop. That's a heavy boat with a lot of shit in there. Guy seems like a good dude too. This is the stage 2 Barracuda.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywhoNOa ... e=youtu.be

Did he say how fast, I couldn't watch with sound

It's simple. get a mud motor. shoot ducks in the face.

No he didn't , probably don't want to give speed claims...