Hey guys, planning on building a mud boat for the summer this year. I am no boater and don’t have much knowledge in the field, I have been researching my head off but am only learning so much.

I have been looking for a 1448 and plan to put a long tail on it. My dad has a blown up Kohler .....27hp? I believe. Which we plan on rebuilding.

I will be primarily using it in the Fox River in Illinois in the summer months when the depth can be an average of 1 foot. I will be using it for fishing.
My buddy has a 1448 alumacraft with a 35hp godevil long tail. I absolutely adore the thing. I like the 14" length and love the width. I don’t think I want to go narrower than 48" since this will be for fishing, and I will be building a deck for it. From what I am reading, a 1448 is not ideal for mud motors. I don’t need speed. Stability and going more than 15mph are my needs.

My biggest question is if I should be getting a short tail or a long tail. Living in Illinois, there are no everglades or giant swamps I will be taking it through. But a small outboard WILL NOT get me through the stretches of river I will need to. There are way to many rocks that will chew an outboard up.
It is very possible for us to build the long/short tail mount with my dad having a full metal/auto shop, but I am having trouble finding plans that seem legit, and he doesn’t have the time anymore to work with me on designing something like that from scratch. I am trying to find a used long tail mount w/out the engine but am not having any success.

I am looking to spend under or around 3k on everything including trailer. It will mainly be used with 2 people, and probably once in a while 3.What do you guys think my options are? I need some one on one experienced input. Thanks a bunch, jake

what do you mean "mount"

Everything but the motor (prop, shaft, frame)
or the bracket that mounts it to the transom?

If you already have a 1448 it will do OK, but you would be amazed at how much performance and load carryin abilities you will gain buy goin up 2 or three feet in length on a boat.

also if the river has a bunch of rocks and stumps you will beat a thin cross braced hull to hell and back, a longitudinally braced 1/8 hull will stand up too the hits better.

Whats wrong with that 27?

yes by mount I mean everything but the motor. The whole mount assembly seems like its going to be my biggest issue.

And im not sure exactly whats wrong with the kohler, we will be taking a look at it on around the 18th of this month when Im back from school for spring break.

Will a 1648 actually go faster than a 1448 due to the plane.....or somthing? Im not really oposed to going over 14', I am just trying to do this as cheap as possible.

and is a longitudinally braced hull common? Its not so much that the river has alot of gravel type bottom I will be scraping against all the time, more like boulders that probably just barely miss the hull. Its not a safe stretch river by any means, butI know it very well, so i will just be crawling throught the dangerous parts. So I dont think the hull will be much of a deciding factor for me.

I think I need the most help and advice with brands of longtails and where to find them.

A frame without a motor is really hard to come by. A longtail will be easier to build, able to run shallower over hard bottoms.... but they are slow and can be hard to drive, especially with bigger motors.

A surface drive is a little more complicated but also easier to drive.

go on ebay and search "mad mud motors" its a book that tells you everything you need to build a longtail and seems to be pretty well put together.


As far as boats, the longer boat has more plaining surface on the bottom and you can distribute the weight over a larger area, a longtail performs best on longer narrower boats so I wouldn't go any wider than 48"

Longitudinally braced boats haven't really caught on yet outside the mudmotor mfg. world so they are hard to find in your part of the country.

In the end you would be better off investing in a mudboat hull that will last you a while instead of beating that boat to shit and havin to buy a new one.

Oh and you would be better off gettin the boat on plane in those rocks as long as they are a few inches under the water and they aint sharp, with the boat on top of the water you miss alot of the stuff you would hit at idle.

I saw the mad mud manual, but the more I read about it the more it seemed to be aimed towards small motors like 6-8hp. Ill give it another look.

Seems like my best bet is to dive in and build my own since I have a possible engine layin around.

Do you know of any brands that make flat bottoms longitudinally braced? I havnt seen any surfin around.

Are most of the brands that make longtails (godevil, bog hog, north florida...) comparable, or is there brands I should stay away from? And I noticed the shaft length on the north florida, and mad mud plans looked alot longer than go devil and bog hog, does this have alot of impact? seems like it would gepardize strength being that long

The longer the shaft the more " reach" you have, there aren't any brands out there right now that I would think are too long to give way.

You can put any size motor on a longtail frame, just as long as your shaft is aligned to the motor and the balance point is in the right spot.

to get a long. braced hull your best bet is lookin around for a used go-devil boat, gator trax, or somethin along those lines.

You wanna go with at least a 16' boat, keep your eye on craigslist, there are always old aluminum hulls on there for dirt cheap that you can fix up and make work until you can afford something better. Whether you are going with a surface drive or longtail is up to you, you'll have to definitely get a rock guard or do something to protect your prop.

Contact Illowa Marine, I believe they are a sponsor on here, they might have some used stuff for you and are in your area.

awsome, thanks alot! yeah ive been looking on craigs list and seen a few allready that might work for around 1000. which is kinda my limit for the boat/trailer. I think ill start by finding a good boat, fix er up, then figure out what im gonna do with the engine/longtail setup.

I think im gonna try and find a 1648. I know it wont go very fast, but i would rather have a stable deck and room to move around while fishing than speed. i just need it te be able to go over 10mph to get through some rapids sections.

Anyone have any idea on the lowest hp range required to get one on plane? while id love a 27 or 35 horse, im sure i wont be able to afford it.

what kind of load will you be carryin?

How much weight in gear and people?

a 16 horse will plane it empty, but loaded down with two peeps, gear, and a battery or two you would want atleast a 23.

The bigger the hp, the harder to drive the boat is.. Have you ever driven a 27-35 longtail?

there is people that sell just frames:
http://batonrouge.craigslist.org/boa/2184358813.html
with a welding shop it wont be too hard to make it fit your motor.

I drove my buddies 1448 with a 35 horse and it was pretty demanding, but I'm 22 and in good shape so thats nothing i wont get used to in a few outings.

My load will be usually my 2 buddies, all three of us weigh right around 140. probably around 150 lbs of gear, including anchors and battery. So most i will ever be carrying is around 550 lbs. normally probably around 400.

I was thinking a 23 horse will prolly be a good choice fora 1648, should do what it needs to?

Three people and gear with a longtail can be pretty slow, so get the most hp you can.

personally, I think a 23 will be a little underpowered with that load.

welllll.....my buddy just called me and lined me up with his buddy thats selling a 16horse vanguard with go devil frame for 600 bucks, i guess its in perfect shape. i dont think i can pass it up for the price.

whats my options with a 16 horse to be able to get on plane? think a 1648 would even plane out with 2 people in it?

Ask him what shape the prop and seals are in, for 600 bucks I would jump on it!

With a little work you can put any hp motor on that frame, some will even bolt right up if the crankshaft (pto) were the same height, do some research to se what the heights are and all you may have to do is drill new holes or drop the motor plate down.

A 16 and 23 have the same hieght, 5 1/2 i do belive.

alitle confused on what your saying about the frame.......the 16 is allready bolted on the go devil frame. or are you just generally commenting on the go devil longtail frame for fit with other size engines?

you think the 16 is enough for a 1648? or should i look for a narrower hull. as long as i can plane out i dont really care that much about speed. for that price, i can allways upgrade to a bigger motor in the next few years. or work on getting that kohler 27 rebuilt in the meantime of running the 16.

what do you think....http://wausau.craigslist.org/boa/2253359398.html

I know its a 14', but its just so damn cheap. figure i might be able to talk him down if i stick 5 bills in his face.

He says 48" beam....does that meen 48 inches at the top? so it wouldnt be a 1448? doesnt a number like 1448 refer to the width of the bottom?

I think im gonna go by tommorow and just take a look.

That's a very narrow boat, it's probably a 36" bottom, basically a flat bottomed canoe. If you wanna have something you can walk around in comfortably, you'd better get a 16' with at least a 42" bottom, wider if you can help it.


Beam width is across the gunwhales, at the top. So that thing is 48" across the top, "1448" would refer to length and bottom width, but this is most likely a 1436.

this is probably a pretty good deal huh? im just not sure whats a great deal yet, too new to the stuff. this is at the way upper end of my spending limit, but if i come across something great ill cough up some cash. http://milwaukee.craigslist.org/boa/2251184262.html

the only reason im considering a little boat like that is becuase if i went with it, my whole boat would only cost me about 1200 bucks with the 16horse godevil. and with a 16horse, i dont have many boat options anyway. It would be a good first boat i think. Should i buy the 16horse for 600 just for resale value alone?

dont buy that rig, a mod v boat wont do right with a mudmudmotor, it plows the bottom and will hurt you in them rocks.

That sixteen horse is worth that just in the frame, buy it to put on a bigger boat and if its underpowered upgrade motors on that frame

i might just settle on a cheap small 14' for my first boat like the other link 4 posts above (not the 3k one), unless i come across a good deal in the next month or so for a 16 footer.

Im just weighing resale options, i think i could resell it for alot more than the invested 1200, especially after i fix it up/carpet it.

just for reference, I have a 1442 and a 13 longtail... it will get 2 people and light gear on plane and run 10-12 mph.

I fish with two people in it all the time and its not unstable, I wouldnt go any narrower though.

how much do you weigh? like deathmetal said, he thinks that boat might only have like a 36" bottom. that sounds way narrow.

But me and my main fishin buddy are both 140 lbs and pretty agile, so im thinkin we will do fine in it. i might as well buy somthing cheap that will actually work with a 16horse for my first boat. agreement? or is that just too narrow to have any fun in?

i just cant get over thinking about having a mud boat that actually planes for 1200 bucks, even if it is small

I wiegh about 120 and my friend wieghs about 180.

A 1436 isnt really a good boat for a mudmotor, if you want to go that narrow you need to go longer... though it will work ok it just takes some gettin used too.
I have a 14x32 in our pond and two people can stand and fish but you have to stay in one spot or it gets tipsy, sittin down is your best bet.

Definetly buy that motor and when you look at the boat see if it has dents infront of the cross braces, if its beat up pretty bad it wont perform.

Run that 16 horse till you come across a good flatbottom 16 ft and you can put the motor on it, if its underpowered the you can put a bigger block on der.

cool man. thanks for all your help. will repost when everything is in posesion!

I have an 1436 jon with a 16 hp with a 8 3/4 x 5 prop and by myself i get 19 mph and i weigh 220 lbs i havent brought the gps with on a 2 man ld yet but i will tell ya it gets on step and runs nice just with two of us just thought i would give you a lil input from another small boat owner lol

hey thanks alot! that is the kind of info im looking for. i took a look at the little 14'er and it was a piece of junk. so i'm gonna keep lookin for a 16', but if i find a good deal on a 14' under 48" ill jump on it.

is that the ideal prop size for a 16 hp? top speed is important to me, since i have no mud to get up and out of.

A 16 horse comes with a 9x3 prop, the bigger the blade to an extent and less pitch the better it carries a load.

More pitch moves the boat forward faster but when you put weight in the boat the rpm's drop and the prop looses speed.

A bigger blade with shorter pitch prolly does the best in mud since it can bite without loadin up.

its a hopkins prop and it balances out to a 9 x 3 from other dealers at least that is what they told me but i can say this much it is doing the trick it performs great in the mud and top end im very pleased with it i went with hopkins just cause he seemed like a real reputable guy on here from other post i have read good luck with it

this would probably be a good match with the 16 horse.?? its its a 1542.
http://bn.craigslist.org/boa/2261763571.html

Yeah, it would prolly do good... trailer needs some attention though.

yeah he said it goes fine down the highway. and we will be able to make anything on the trailer work when i get it home so thats no biggie.

Lets just hope it doesnt get sold till saterday when i go back home!

would anyone recomend this over a 16'?

There would be some benifit to the extra foot, there are some on here that run rigs that size and are happy though.

think it would actually go faster? wheres the cuttoff point you think with a 16? 17' prolly? just seems like it would be geting to heavy overall after 15/16

It should be a good little rig, I thought you were goin with a bigger motor to start with.

well we have a bigger kohler, but it needs to be tottally rebuilt, it was blown up due to it being run on a chipper with no air cleaner, and submerged. I know my way around an engine, but it will be quite a project for me to tottaly fix/rebuild it. so ill put the 16 on it to start, and if the finished boat comes out real nice and i end up fixing the engine ill put it on there.

Sounds like a plan, now buy it before somebody else does!

ya man, the go devils on lock, but i doubt the boat will last till saterday! crossin fingers